wat is the most effective way to get ssai baba blessings and talk to him..??

[rr_sai_bhakt]

Dear asterias ji,

I will take up point no 2,

Sai Baba never insists on any one praying to Him ... This is what i feel ..

What i think is that even if you are a genuinely good human being, Baba will bless you regardless of whether you pray to Him or not.

Now lets come to what exactly constitutes prayer?

Dont you think if you are helping the poor and needy, you are praying to Baba?
Dont you think if you have only good thoughts in your mind and if you completely weed out anger, jealousy, hatred, envy etc, then also you are praying to Baba?
Dont you think if you do selfless service to others then also you are praying to Baba?


But how many of us lead such a life? Is it practically possible for us be this way always?

No right ... so that means off and on we will have negative thoughts in our mind. Off and on we will refuse to help the poor and needy that we see in front of us... We will be selfish at many times .. speak rudely to others .... be envious of others.

Are these not bad karmas?

When we say bad karmas does it only mean some great crime?

No right, so each of us have some bad karmas right ...

Now that we cannot always maintain the right kind of lifestyle and end up doing not the right kind of things, then what is the recourse?

How do we ask for forgiveness for our wrong deeds?

Thats when the Prayer in the form of chanting God's name is recommended....

So what is prayer? It is only an atonement for all our wrong deeds.

Its not a businessman kind of a thing with Baba as you have mentioned ... that if you pray to me only then I will bless you ..

No, that is not what Baba says or means ...

Prayer is an incentive to be a good person .... Prayer is a motivation to be a good person ... Prayer is so that you do not involve your mind in negative thoughts .... If you as a human do not have the capability to always have only pure and positive thoughts in your mind, thats when you need Prayer.... so that atleast for the duration that you Pray, you are not focusing on negative thoughts... you are focusing on God ..

And what does God say - be humble, be helpful ... so when you are Praying, for that duration you are negating your pride and ego and focusing on being humble and helpful ..

Baba has advocated Prayer as the easiest means to get what you want ...

Baba knows that we as humans have our drawbacks .... and not all of us can lead a spirititually strong life ... We all have our worldly desires and ambitions too ...

So Baba says, if you can just do so much as Pray, you will have some good results coming out of that ...

So in essence, Baba is the Karunamayi ... because he is not saying go and do penance for so many years to get what you want.
He is giving you the easiest means to be a good human being - Prayer ...

He is taking all the spiritual struggles on Himself so that you and I do not have to go thru all that to get what we want ...

So He is not trading blessings for prayers .... He is encouraging us to be good human beings through our prayers ... that is the most essential thing isnt it ... if we want a happy life for everyone ...

If you can be a good human being always, and on your own and can take a spiritual journey on your own ... then so be it ... in that case you will not need Baba's blessings at all ... since you can achieve all that on your own.

But most of the mortals on this planet cannot do that ... and so Baba has given them an easy recourse in the form of prayers..

These are my personal thoughts though ...

Om Sai Ram ...

[v2birit]

"Reading Sai Stories & remembering him"  is the easiest way given in Sai Satcharitra itself


Om Sai Ram

[saisan]

om sai ram
Dear asterias ji,
read sai charitra you will get all answers for your questions.

[GaneshHariharan]

Dear Asterias,

I (may) have answered your queries below -

Om Sai Ram !

Dear Ganeshji

What you say really opens a lot more questions -

1. How did I get karma in the first place. If this is my first birth - can have any type of karma  - Sanchita or Prarabdha ?

-It is said that the soul takes up this human birth after going through some thousands of bodies. The concept of dasavatharam, ten incarnations of Vishnu is exactly this.
 So if you are human ,then this cannot be your first birth.When we reach human birth, the process of evolution is no more natural. Yes, you read it correct. Several enlightened
 masters have talked about it. Swami Nithyananda says, 'the natural process of evolution stops with human birth. Now it is in your hands.'

2. I equate Baba to a businessman and not Karunamayi - because He expects us to pray and without our praying He is not listening to us. He is a businessman in the sense that    without prayers He is not coming forward Himself. He is a businessman because He is suffering (giving us goods) based on our prayers ( our money)

- A businessman does things for profit (if you know anyone who does not , pls provide me with an email address , i would very much like to contact him    )
  by taking our sufferings upon himself is baba profiting ?
 
3. If you call Karma and Baba different then say that Baba is more powerful than Karma then how can you use the analogy of apples and oranges. Apples and Oranges are both fruits. Are Baba and Karma both similar (in sense of fruits)

- They are both fruits , true but maybe i phrased it wrongly. my intention was to clarify that an apple is ≠ an orange.

4. Whom do you call Karunamayi ? How do you define someone as benevolent? If you compare Baba to school then I say that the fees are the prayers without which there is no admission. Baba seems benevolent once fees (prayers) have been paid - in this sense He is NOT benevolent.

- Benevolence is the expression of kindness and altruism.
  Benevolence means much good for others. As such, it is a form of love. But some theologians, such as Thomas Jay Oord, have argued that love involves both giving and receiving. A   
  loving person must, then, be both benevolent and open to receiving good gifts from others.

  But Baba never ever , be it when he was amongst us or after mahasamadhi , asked anybody to pray to him or give him dakshina. It is when we are neck deep in our troubles that
  we search out various incarnations of god and pray to them to get us out of  our misery.
 
  Also let me quote an incident from the Sai Satcharitra - Once when baba was sitting near the Dhuni , he suddenly put his hand into the fire and burnt his hand. When asked about
  this he explained that a few miles away , there was an ironmongers wife who when her husband called out to her rushed to his aid without paying attention to the shild in her folds.
  the child was to fall into the ironmongers bhatti and baba by putting his hand in the Dhuni thus saved the child.

Having said all this , i must say "To the believer no explanation is necessary, to the Non-Believer no explanation is enough" and that these are my personal thoughts gained purely through printed sources , i have never studied under a Guru to attain a level of knowledge so as to completely satisfy the "Seekers of Truth". So pardon me if my answers are found
wanting .


Om Shri Sainathaya Namaha
Om Sai Ram !

[saib]

Good to see this conversation. Ganesh Ji has already given good explanation. Still sharing something.

Years ago, when I was student of martial art school, one day there was demonstration. One of our instructors just jumped upward & he was on roof. (almost 12 ft. high). Another Broke five solid ice bars with foreheads. Lots of power demonstration. If I’ll tell someone, He won’t believe, as he will think as per his own limited capacity. He can’t go beyond the power of his brain & his spiritual level.

Same way to believe in God, one has to realize God. Accept fully.

It was starting days of my martial art career. Just to add traditional strength. I went to one Akhada (Local Gym) in the morning. It was old and very few people used to come there. Found no one there except statue of Hanuman Ji. I was confused that who would teach me. Then I bowed hanuman ji & request him to take care of my training. Three months and my strength were three times. I could run miles without getting tired, could lift weight in the manner beyond imagination of an ordinary man. It happened only because of trust. When I bowed before Hanuman Ji, There was not even 0.1% doubt in my mind. For me He was there, and Good enough to train any body. The Supreme Master.

It is also interesting; I was not devotee of Hanuman Ji. I never visited his temple. Still he helped and accepted me as his follower.

Similarly, when I was jobless for three months, just one song that I heard made me request to Sai and next day I was selected in walk in interview where more than 500 candidates appeared. For others it may be co-incidence or miracle, for me it was baba’s sign that there is some one to take care.

It is said Sai is businessman. Yes, He is. But he trade against Love, possess good human qualities and nothing else. In my whole life I went Sai temple only twice. I hardly saw him on any TV Serial. I’ve just begun chanting of his name & reading Sai Sat Charitra last year only. Baba never said to give him money, He was never hungry for material things. He never set any ritual or system to follow. He was and is hungry of only love of his devotees.

God can not be realized with a doubtful mind. One has to keep his all logics aside to realize God. Buddha spent years in search of knowledge but attain enlightened when left all questions all expectations.

One more thing it is very small to judge power of God through Miracles. At micro level even a yogi can do lots of miracles using power of his aura. If you wish to feel miracle, whole universe is miracle itself.

Sometimes what silence can speak, millions of words can’t express. God can be realized only as per thy wish. One has to go for various tests to qualify. One has to follow this path with utmost faith & patience. (Shardha & Saburi) as Prahlad & Dhruv.

May Sai Bless All.

Om Sri Sai Ram!

[GaneshHariharan]

Good one Saib. Om Sairam.

[asterias]

Om Sai Ram !


Dear Ganeshji

What you say really opens a lot more questions -

1. How did I get karma in the first place. If this is my first birth - can have any type of karma  - Sanchita or Prarabdha ?

-It is said that the soul takes up this human birth after going through some thousands of bodies. The concept of dasavatharam, ten incarnations of Vishnu is exactly this.
 So if you are human ,then this cannot be your first birth.When we reach human birth, the process of evolution is no more natural. Yes, you read it correct. Several enlightened
 masters have talked about it. Swami Nithyananda says, 'the natural process of evolution stops with human birth. Now it is in your hands.'

There are several objections to it. I accept that human birth is a result of evolution. However the other things that you say are like mixing this "evolution" concept with biology. There is something wrong in it.

For example animals do things based on instinct - there is no karma attached to it. Plus according to our scriptures animal births - or a birth with lower levels of consciousness are based on previous bad karmas. My question is how did I get the previous bad karma if I started as animal and all that I did is based on instinct alone. ( As such, in animal janmas we dont add any more karmas)

2. I equate Baba to a businessman and not Karunamayi - because He expects us to pray and without our praying He is not listening to us. He is a businessman in the sense that    without prayers He is not coming forward Himself. He is a businessman because He is suffering (giving us goods) based on our prayers ( our money)

- A businessman does things for profit (if you know anyone who does not , pls provide me with an email address , i would very much like to contact him    )
  by taking our sufferings upon himself is baba profiting ?
 
You are not getting the point. He is suffering - only when I pray. Is HE suffering without my praying too ?

3. If you call Karma and Baba different then say that Baba is more powerful than Karma then how can you use the analogy of apples and oranges. Apples and Oranges are both fruits. Are Baba and Karma both similar (in sense of fruits)

- They are both fruits , true but maybe i phrased it wrongly. my intention was to clarify that an apple is ≠ an orange.


Again apple is not orange, and hence according to you incomparable, yet to compare them by saying that Baba can help you get rid of Karma (that is apple is better than orange)

4. Whom do you call Karunamayi ? How do you define someone as benevolent? If you compare Baba to school then I say that the fees are the prayers without which there is no admission. Baba seems benevolent once fees (prayers) have been paid - in this sense He is NOT benevolent.

- Benevolence is the expression of kindness and altruism.
  Benevolence means much good for others. As such, it is a form of love. But some theologians, such as Thomas Jay Oord, have argued that love involves both giving and receiving. A   
  loving person must, then, be both benevolent and open to receiving good gifts from others.

  But Baba never ever , be it when he was amongst us or after mahasamadhi , asked anybody to pray to him or give him dakshina. It is when we are neck deep in our troubles that
  we search out various incarnations of god and pray to them to get us out of  our misery.
 
Baba clearly asked people to give Him dakshina. Rather He also said that I have to account to every paise that comes to me. Everyday He used to "demand" dakshina

Having said all this , i must say "To the believer no explanation is necessary, to the Non-Believer no explanation is enough" and that these are my personal thoughts gained purely through printed sources , i have never studied under a Guru to attain a level of knowledge so as to completely satisfy the "Seekers of Truth". So pardon me if my answers are found
wanting .

Neither am I a seeker of truth. My intention is to clarify my own understanding


Om Sai Ram

[asterias]

Om Sai Ram !

Dont you think if you are helping the poor and needy, you are praying to Baba?

If I am serving the poor and needy then i am atleast trying to see Baba in everyone - then its  a prayer

Dont you think if you have only good thoughts in your mind and if you completely weed out anger, jealousy, hatred, envy etc, then also you are praying to Baba?

If I am in that state, I dont need to pray to Baba

Dont you think if you do selfless service to others then also you are praying to Baba?

Nishkaama Karma is almost impossible from our level.

Om Sai Ram !

[asterias]

Om Sai Ram !

Dear saib

Extremely Extremely well said

It is said Sai is businessman. Yes, He is. But he trade against Love, possess good human qualities and nothing else. In my whole life I went Sai temple only twice. I hardly saw him on any TV Serial. I’ve just begun chanting of his name & reading Sai Sat Charitra last year only. Baba never said to give him money, He was never hungry for material things. He never set any ritual or system to follow. He was and is hungry of only love of his devotees.

God can not be realized with a doubtful mind. One has to keep his all logics aside to realize God. Buddha spent years in search of knowledge but attain enlightened when left all questions all expectations.

One more thing it is very small to judge power of God through Miracles. At micro level even a yogi can do lots of miracles using power of his aura. If you wish to feel miracle, whole universe is miracle itself.

Sometimes what silence can speak, millions of words can’t express. God can be realized only as per thy wish. One has to go for various tests to qualify. One has to follow this path with utmost faith & patience. (Shardha & Saburi) as Prahlad & Dhruv.

May Sai Bless All.

I am not talking about disbelief or doubting Baba. What I am trying to emphasize is that full faith or trust - comes only with understanding. Blind belief is very hard to sustain, or rather it is unsustainable. The key is UNDERSTANDING.

Om Sai Ram !

[rr_sai_bhakt]

Dear Asterias ji,

Thank you for your reply.

As per the second quoted point in your post, thats exactly what i said -

"  If you can be a good human being always, and on your own and can take a spiritual journey on your own ... then so be it ... in that case you will not need Baba's blessings at all ... since you can achieve all that on your own.  "

Also in my opinion, Faith is a very personal subject ... since each person is different and their ability to UNDERSTAND is also different, each person's definition of Faith can also vary ...  and hence the same path cannot be the best path or the only sustainable path for everyone ...

Here is an anecdote -

A person was walking along a road to reach the next town. He was tired and wanted to reach the next town as soon as possible but was not sure of the path ahead. Some distance ahead he saw a Sadhu walking. He caught up with the Sadhu and asked him - "Can you please tell me the path to the next town and how much time it will take me to reach there".

The Sadhu told him, "Walk along with me" ...

After walking along for sometime the Sadhu turned to the person walking behind him and said " You are on the right path ... just walk ahead and you will reach the next town in half an hour".

The person asked the Sadhu, "Why did you not tell me these details back there itself that the next town is half an hour ahead".

So the Sadhu replied. " I could not as I did not know your speed of walking. I wanted to know your speed of walking before giving you the answer" ..

---------------------------

Many of us give replies to other ppl based on our speed of walking without knowing if thats the same speed that the other person maintains or not ... He can be slower than us or he can be faster than us ...

Everyone's way and method of understanding is very different ...

Also I dont think you need to see Baba in the poor and needy to serve them ... you can do this just because you see and feel their pain and suffering .....  Even then that would be a prayer to Baba .... and again, you need not serve the poor and needy only as a prayer to Baba, isnt it ... you can do that because of your inner conscience asks you to do it ...

But as you say, and i completely agree, that this sort of nishkarma seva is impossible at our level.
So what is the recourse?

My personal view is that there is no hard and fast rule to say that only if I do such and such a thing then i have faith and trust in Baba.

And then there is also a question of why does each person want to have his or her faith and trust in Baba? Is it to achieve some wish of theirs that they see is not being fulfilled ... or is to for a genuine spiritual purpose?

If a person does his job with full dedication, follows a family life with full dedication and leads a normal life - then would that also be a prayer? ....

Om Sai Ram ....

Om Sai Ram !

Dont you think if you are helping the poor and needy, you are praying to Baba?

If I am serving the poor and needy then i am atleast trying to see Baba in everyone - then its  a prayer

Dont you think if you have only good thoughts in your mind and if you completely weed out anger, jealousy, hatred, envy etc, then also you are praying to Baba?

If I am in that state, I dont need to pray to Baba

Dont you think if you do selfless service to others then also you are praying to Baba?

Nishkaama Karma is almost impossible from our level.

Om Sai Ram !

[asterias]

Om Sai Ram !

Dear rr ji

I agree with what you say, but however thats besides the point. What started the whole discussion was Karma vs. Baba. What do you have to say on that ?

if we pray baba the suffering will be less and he will also bear pain with us.you need to fight with bad karmas with good deeds in present.its not only bad karmas there is also good karmas,if ur previous karmas are good then u will enjoy the life and all good things happen to them even if they don't pray.

You are saying that "if we pray Baba", which means that if I dont pray to Baba and my previous Karma is bad, He will not help me ? Is that what you mean by the above statement ?

Om Sai Ram !

[rr_sai_bhakt]

Dear Asterias ji,

(Just as a minor clarification, i did not make that statement).

However lets keep that beside the main point, and let me attempt to answer your post with my very limited knowledge/understanding-

So i will again go to my earlier points. What is meant by praying to Baba? Is it only chanting his name always? Is it always doing Bhajans and Kirtans in Baba's name?

I do not believe so ... I feel different people have different ways of expressing Faith in Baba. My personal belief is that even if you do not chant Sai's name always, however if you do good deeds and are a good human being, then also Baba will bless you and help you overcome your Bad Karmas.

Baba does not say, "Only if you pray chanting out "my name", only then it is a prayer to me." I personally believe, Baba says - "Even if you are a good Human Being, and do not pray to me chanting out my name always then thats more than enough for me. I will bless you even in that case. I will help you overcome your bad karmas even in that case."

This is how i interpret Baba and his teachings.

Now my question to you is, since we cannot be good Human Beings always, and there is more than a 100 % chance that we might end up committing various wrong acts, then what do we do in such a case?

Since i am not being a good human being doing good deeds, how do i overcome my previous and current bad karmas?

Is it for this reason, that Baba says, "Fine I understand that you have committed wrong acts. No problem. All human beings end up doing such things. Now if you can only do so much as chant my name, then I can help lessen the effect of your previous karmas."

So when Baba asks us to chant his name, is he using that as a genuine repentance from our part for our past karmas?

Is this why Baba asks for such a simple commitment from people like us, so that we need not to go through difficult situations to overcome our previous karmas?

Now, if we cannot be good human beings always, and neither do we want to chant Baba's name, then should we expect help from Baba in such a case?

Om Sai Ram ...

[asterias]

Om Sai Ram !

Dear rr ji

(Just as a minor clarification, i did not make that statement).

I want to analyse this sentence (not statement ) of yours ..

 

Now if you can only do so much as chant my name, then I can help lessen the effect of your previous karmas

This is precisely what I am referring to - the IF and THEN relationship.

And this is the reason for my statement that, based on this relationship, Baba seems to be a businessman. Why shoult be there IF and THEN. Why not He do it all Himself

Om Sai Ram !

[rr_sai_bhakt]

Ok Asterias ji,

Lets have this discussion in this manner -

So lets say you have some bad karmas.

Now you do not want to do the good deeds required to overcome these bad karmas.

You do not want to express genuine repentance for any of the wrong acts committed knowingly.

So, ideally, in what manner would you want to he helped so that you can overcome all your bad karmas, past or present?

Please let me know ..

Om Sai Ram ...

[GaneshHariharan]

Dear Asterias ji, Please correct me if i am wrong. But if i understand your posts correctly , what you are saying is that , were Baba to vanquish all the badness in this world without people doing anything or praying for it  , just out of the goodness of his heart then he is not a businessman , otherwise he is a businessman ! did i get it right ?

Om Sairam.